Harry Reid and Ed Kennedy need a History Lesson on Vietnam ... among other things

The press was salivating yesterday after President Bush’s address to the Veterans of Foreign Wars national convention. The President used the “V” word in a public speech, Vietnam. ……….Quick everyone run for cover!!

My only response is, it’s about time! The parallels between Vietnam and Iraq as far as a pull out is concerned are irrefutable. I am just surprised that it took the White House this long to get the sound bite our there. As a student, if you will of the political landscape of Vietnam, I can tell you that after the White House, overwhelmed with political pressure from Congress, decided to cut their losses and pull out of Vietnam, it cost our former ally dearly. Millions of Vietnamese in the South were brutally murdered. Those fortunate enough to receive a reprieve from the Communists spent years, some even decades in reeducation camps.

This was all done due to political ideology. Can you imagine what the aftermath would be like for those Iraqis who supported a more democratic environment in such a rigidly fundamentalist view? I can assure you, the insurgents will make Southeast Asia’s vengeance like a day at the park. The killing will be brutal and public for all the world to see.

We must keep in mind that the Internet will give the insurgents their very own outlet to share in the glory of Allah’s victory against the infidels.

I am reminded of a recent Fox News report in which Jane Fonda, after making a brief appearance at a anti-war rally, was confronted by one of Fox’s correspondents. When asked if she felt somewhat responsible for the death of some three million innocent Vietnamese after the fall of Saigon, her response was very telling. She said, nothing. Images of Lady McBeth washing the guilty blood off her hands instantly came to mind when I saw that clip.

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid(D-NV), quickly dismissed Bush’s position.

“President Bush’s attempt to compare the war in Iraq to past military conflicts in East Asia ignores the fundamental difference between the two,” he said. “Our nation was misled by the Bush administration in an effort to gain support for the invasion of Iraq under false pretenses, leading to one of the worst foreign policy blunders in our history.”

Huh? You Knucklehead! What got us into the War in Vietnam? Does the Gulf of Tonkin ring any bells? WMDs are a tad more daunting than someone taking a pot shot at one of our boats. And let's be realistic for a moment, shall we? If you announce on international TV that you suspect another nation of having WMDs and then spend 3 months getting the UN off their proverbial tails to send people in to check. What do you think is going to happen while you play nice with Kofi Annan? Those WMDs are going to sneak right out the back doing into Iran.

Sen. Edward Kenney (D-Mass) who, responded to the President’s speech by saying, “The President is drawing the wrong lesson from history” and that we,”lost the war in Vietnam because our troops were trapped in a distant country we did not understand, supporting a government that lacked sufficient legitimacy with its people."

First, to set the Senator straight, we didn’t lose the war in Vietnam. Our troops, just like those fighting in Iraq today, gave the very best they had but were figuratively fighting with one arm tied behind their back because politicians, only concerned with re-election, were Monday morning QBing. Few people are aware of the rules of engagement that were used in various parts of Vietnam. Most of which were mirroring images of what we see today. Politicians with no real comprehension of military tactics or capabilities are sticking their necks where they don’t belong. And, just for the sake of argument, those dimwits in Hollywood can be thrown into this mix as well.

I personally have seen documents that state that US Troops at various points during the war were told they could not shot until engaged by the enemy. That is to say, if a Marine were to see a VC creeping up on their location, he could not take that soldier out until he fired on the Marine’s position. Better yet, is the fact that when US troops were planning operations in areas where there was a civilian population, this is no kidding folks, LEAFLETS were dropped into the areas a few days before to warn the civilians that US Troops would soon be in the area. Hey, there is nothing like letting the enemy know what you are doing before you do it. Who the hell needs spies, we will just give you our play book.

So, Sen. Kennedy, let me leave you with a quote that I sincerely hope you have heard before;

"The mere absesnce of war is not peace" - John F. Kennedy


Update: Here is more to support my point of view

McCain and Kissenger: Strange Bedfellows?

I just love this political cartoon. Kudos to the artists at Cagle Cartoons!


NewsMax just reported that former Secretary of State Henry Kissenger has thrown his support behind the McCain 2008 Campaign. For some this may not be anything to write home about but this article might well be the reason why Kissenger is suddenly being thrown into the limelight during his 2008 Campaign.

Now, in his latest shift to the right, McCain is openly embracing Kissinger. Hotline On Call reports that McCain has chosen Kissinger to be the Honorary Co-Chair for his presidential campaign in New York.

Ok, understandably, McCain may well feel that he needs a boost in New York considering the grasp that Hillary has on NYC and her "home state". If you ask this New Yorker and just about any other, we will tell you that Hillary isn't a New Yorker. She may live here but she isn't one of us. Regardless, McCain may want a voice in Hillary's backyard as well as Rudy Guiliani's. An obscene amount campaign donations come from the New York City area and obviously, McCain wants a piece of that pie.

Yet, if you look at the second link above, you will see quotes from Kissenger such as;

Kissinger sensed wobbliness everywhere on Iraq, and he increasingly saw it through the prism of the Vietnam War. For Kissinger, the overriding lesson of Vietnam is to stick it out.

In his writing, speeches and private comments, Kissinger claimed that the United States had essentially won the war in 1972, only to lose it because of the weakened resolve of the public and Congress.

In a column in The Washington Post on Aug. 12, 2005, titled “Lessons for an Exit Strategy,” Kissinger wrote, “Victory over the insurgency is the only meaningful exit strategy.”

McCain is making his friendship with Kissenger more public because of Henry's POV on Iraq and it's inevitable comparison with Vietnam, a war that Kissenger claims the US had won but didn't have the longevity to stay the course. Yet, due to the atmosphere at home, very similar to the air today over Iraq, we left before the job was done. This is the one campaign issue that McCain doesn't seem to be flip-flopping on (too much). So Henry gives him, as well as Bush, some credibility on Iraq.

McCain has made Kissenger his honorary co-chairman of his finance efforts in NY. Here is another place that lists many prominent New Yorkers who have agreed to join the McCain Train. One of them being former Ambassador to Vietnam, Pete Peterson. It seems that McCain is attempting to discretely campaign on his Vietnam experience, something that groups like the US Veteran Dispatch, the soon to be Vietnam Veterans Against John McCain, and just about every POW/MIA group you can think of, will do all they can to discredit.

Yet, it appears that Kissenger may well be taking a page from McCain's book of tricks as you can see here . A November 2006 Washington Post article cites Kissenger as saying that victory in Iraq was not possible. So I guess flip-floppers enjoy each others' company as well. Imagine my surprise!

Charles Schumer (D-NY) and Vietnam

The humble Senator from NY


There are far too many reasons to deny being a New Yorker these days. From a Victory Caucus stand point, the top two reasons aren't really reasons, but names; Schumer and Clinton. Watching them muddle through their self-made minefield on the Iraq War was entertaining for a while but now it is bordering on shameful. Both this weekend have gotten press, Hillary for stating that redeployment needs to start within 90 days or Congress will start legislating and Schumer stating that even with this defeat of the non-binding resolution in the Senate, the Democrats will be "relentless" proposing resolution after resolution "just like in the days of Vietnam."

Now, if you stop by here often, it is quite clear that I know Vietnam. The simple fact that Schumer would correlate Iraq with Vietnam shows just how little he knows and understands about this quasi fictitious war. Now, I know it was a real war, I use the word fictitious because few know the real Vietnam. Many take their understanding of Vietnam from Hollywood and the likes of Oliver Stone or even worse, the ramblings of John Forbes Kerry as he systematically used these heroes as a springboard to his political career. For more fun on Kerry, I would suggest visiting this site.

The NY Times provides a Reuters piece that conveniently leaves out the Vietnam reference. In fact, I have been hard pressed to find the initial source of this quote. If anyone has it, please forward it to me. The best I could find was this article by McClatchy Newspapers.

So, at this point, we can tentatively come to two conclusions 1) it was a misquote or 2) the MSM has collectively decided to exclude that portion of the quote in the hopes that it will become dormant. Knowing Schumer like I do, I tend to believe the latter rather than the former. He, in typical down-state NY fashion, likes to showboat, give the heated comment to get attention of the crowd and get some press.

Why even make the Vietnam comment? Was it necessary? Do we really need more Vietnam references in this war? And, in case Chuck missed it, Vietnam didn't end very well or maybe in his mind, it did. If that is the case, then I may have more to worry about than I thought.

What Redeployment and Protests Really Mean: A Lesson from Vietnam

Since Hanoi Jane is back in the limelight after her latest anti-war rally in DC, it’s worth looking back with a little 20/20 vision on Vietnam and what our pulling out did not just to Vietnam but to our nation as well.

There is a wealth of info out there on Vietnam that truly is amazing. Here are a few interesting ROE (Rules of Engagement) factoids for you.

1 – No matter the circumstances, do not shoot unless you are shot at first.
Translation: If you are out in the boonies with your platoon and see VC approaching across a rice patty. Keep those weapons down, Boys.
Yes, folks this was actually an ROE in parts of I Corps during the early phases of the war. Why? Because the enemy was not easily identified and civilian casualties were bad PR. Sound familiar?

2 – When an operation was going to be executed in a rural area that most likely had civilians in the vicinity, leaflets were dropped a day or two before to “warn” the locals that we would be coming. Hey! Nothing like letting the enemy know where to find you. No joke folks, I have actually seen copies of the leaflets. (Reminds me of that hilarious scene in “Heartbreak Ridge” when Gunny Highway blows a gasket because Major Powers has the ambush site pre-arranged for a training exercise)

I can tell you right now that these two ROEs did not come from the Pentagon but from those politicians in Washington who, for all extensive purposes left our fighting men with one hand politically tied behind their backs from the mid 60’s until the final pull out on 1975. Sound familiar?

The next step is to consider what the anti-war rallies did to the men in the field, those being held in POW camps and to the propaganda machine of the enemy. We are obviously seeing in recent days the beginning of what Vietnam Vets must have felt upon hearing Jane Fonda, Tom Hayden and others spouting what many believe equates to treason when we hear last Friday’s NBC Nightly News report from Iraq. In this report Staff Sergeant Manuel Sahagun was interviewed and stated, ”one thing I don't like is when people back home say they support the troops, but they don't support the war. If they're going to support us, support us all the way.” Here the Staff Sergeant is expressing frustration, which will most likely escalate to other, stronger emotions as the MSM has their way with the minds of the American people. The point that many reporters just refuse to accept is that the men in the field are more knowledgeable about what is going on in Iraq than they are and they don’t like it. What a reporter may see in the act of witnessing a tactical operation in the field will not have the same translation as the men who planned and organized the mission and who have the military training to know why they do what they do. A reporter, no matter how good, will not have the trained military eye to truly understand what is transpiring before their eyes. There is no “War for Dummies” book out there. The MSM just can’t handle this simple fact that a 19 year-old kid from Missouri has a better grasp of a given situation than a seasoned journalist who has spent the last ten years honing his/her craft. They aren’t about to let some snot-nosed kid show them up.

This next section is not well know outside of certain circles, and for those who don’t know a lot about the POW situation in Vietnam, please, pay close attention. When the anti-war machine started gaining momentum in the US, the North Vietnamese were quick to take advantage of this unsolicited propaganda and use it against the thousand or so US POWs that were held both in the North and South. Many misrepresent the Vietnamese as a ragtag loosely structured fighting force. We must not forget that the Vietnamese had been fighting off aggressors for decades before we arrived, the most recent aggressor before the US arrived in the early 60’s were the French and it is no secret that the French were paying off the Vietnamese behind closed doors long after their war ended in exchange for prisoners the Vietnamese held back after the French officially pulled out their troops. In short, these guys weren’t stupid, they knew exactly what to do and how and people like Fonda were just feeding the beast. Sound familiar?

Many uninformed Americans consider the insurgency to be a group of ragtag loosely structured fighting units. Today’s insurgency is fueled by more than our Vietnamese enemy was 40 years ago. In Nam it was the political threat of Communism yet the insurgency, because of the intermingling of their politics and their religion, have more at stake than their form of government. For those held in the now infamous Hanoi Hilton, tape recordings of Jane Fonda and others were piped right into their cells via a PA system. During torture sessions they were reminded that their fellow Americans considered them criminals by quoting these treasonous statement. Additionally, what I consider the most damning of statements, they attempted to drive home the fact that no one at home cared about them and claimed “we can keep you forever”. Even today, these former POWs question the short sightedness of these anti-war protestors and even many within our government. I highly recommend the DVD Stolen Honor which focuses on a series of present day interviews with former POWs from Vietnam who detail exactly what the anti-war movement meant to them when they were behind bars. Just imagine for a moment, knowing the kinds of excruciating torture that you were being subjected to both physical and mental only to have Fonda, Hayden and others come visit you in prison and reaffirm how thankful you must be for the kind treatment of your captors.

Now here is where Vietnam and Iraq diverge, once our troops were pulled out of Vietnam, we simply packed our bags and went home, left with the perception of having lost the first military conflict of our nation’s history. As false and untrue as that idea of defeat was, and as horrible as the reception our troops received upon their return home, at least it was definitely over for the US. The Vietnamese took their spoils of war and went home.

This is NOT the case with Iraq. Yes, if we pull out before the job is done as we did in Vietnam, there will be civilian atrocities that may well mirror Nam and many Vets of this latest conflict will have to deal with the difficult reality of the anhialation of their former counterparts who whom they fought the good fight. But Iraq will not end there. Many Americans have turned into perpetual ostriches refusing to accept the fact that the insurgency is about much more than who is in control in Iraq. The enemy will not stand up dust themselves off, pat each other on the back and go back home. They have been programmed to believe that their purpose in life is to destroy our way of life, our belief system and to either convert us to Islam or kill us for our defiance. They have openly stated this over and over.

This hasn’t been called the War on Terror for nothing, Folks. They will bring the war to a city near you in short order. And don’t think for a minute that pulling out of Iraq will not fuel their thirst even more giving them the perception, just as in Nam, that they were able to defeat the most powerful military force on the planet not by over powering them but by simply knowing the enemy and that we are a nation of instantaneous gratification. We are a spoiled people, always used to getting what we want at the drop of a hat. I think back to what my grandparents were asked to sacrifice during WWII in the name of the war effort, what has been asked of the American people today? “Support the Troops, all the way”, so little to ask compared to past generations yet the real question is, “What is the alternative?”

I don’t know about you but I like being able to pray to whom I want, when I want and that my daughters can be whoever they want to be.

How about you?